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House | May 14, 2013 | Committee Room | Appropriations

Full MP3 Audio File

Committee will come to order. Members will take their seats, and the folks in the audience will take any conversations outside. We would appreciate it. We want to welcome today four of our pages, and if you would raise your hand when we call out your name. Kaylen Bell from Forsyth County, who is sponsored by Representative Bell, is with us. Sadie Forsyth from Mecklenburg County, sponsored by Representative Schaffer. Carolyn Fry from Johnston County, sponsored by Representative Daughtry. And Mary Hannah from Lee County, sponsored by Representative Stone. We have with us as our Sergeant at Arms today Carlton Adams, Bob ??, Yung Bay, Joe Crook, and Antoine Marshall. First bill we will take up on the calendar is House Bill 27, Worker's Compensation Fund, Worker's Compensation Allocation, and Representative Howard is recognized to present the bill, and is this a PCS? Representative Torbett moves that the PCS be properly before the committee without objection. Representative Howard is recognized to explain the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you Mr. Chairman and members of the committee. I will just quickly say that I hope that appropriations will treat the finance side kindly. This PCS is very important for the firemen across the State. We're doing an adjustment on the Worker's Compensation fund. It does not generate or require any new money. It's just the way that the money is distributed. It will fix the problem, and I'll be glad to go through the entire explanation, but it basically dedicates up to 20% of the proceeds to the Worker's Compensation for the benefit of the volunteer safety workers, and we are reducing from 30% to 25% the amount of the net proceeds that is remitted to the volunteer fire department fund. It reduces from 25 to 20 the amount of the net proceeds that is credited to the department of insurance for the disbursement to the county fire districts, and the remaining 35% between the amount remitted to the Worker's Compensation fund and the 20% cap would be remitted to the general fund as always. The second major change - there's a reduction from 10% to 1% the amount that is retained by the department of insurance for the administration of the volunteer fire department fund, and with that Mr. Chairman, I'll stand to answer any questions, and would ask for members to support the PCS. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mr. Chairman. [SPEAKER CHANGES] And to clarify, this is not a PCS, so you should have the bill before you. Representative Avila is recognized. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I want to just make sure I have the right copy. She mentioned a lot of changes that I don't see underlined in the copy that I've got, if I'm looking at the right bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] PCS has not been passed out. We'll have to displace it and come back. We will temporarily displace the bill, and will come back to it when the copies are made of the PCS. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mr. Chairman [SPEAKER CHANGES] Representative Torbett. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Just like to denote for representative Howard, this does not mean that we're not being nice to you, we're just - [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I trust you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Next bill on calendar should be passed out to you, you should have it. House Bill 157

Speaker: Representative Jeeder, limited highway fund credit balance. I believe this is a PCS. The bill should be in your stack. The gentleman is recognized. Representative: This is a bill that limits the use of the highway fund outside of the budget process. It does nothing that has to do with the direct budget. The original intent of the law, as it was established years ago, gave the governor flexibility to allocate funds out of the highway fund if highway 12 washed out over on the coast, if there was a rock slide on highway 40, if there was a sink hole that had a road cave in. This gave the governor the ability to fix those problems. Over time it has been used in other ways that had nothing to do with roads and infrastructure. This, for all intent purposes, all it really does is, if you look on page 1, line 14, it changes the current language of, “other urgent needs,” which has meant anything in the world, to, “other urgent road construction and road maintenance needs.” Happy to answer any questions. Happy to talk all day. Speaker: Representative Cleveland, you are recognized. Representative: For a motion. Speaker: If you will hold that for a moment. Any questions or comments from the committee. If not, Representative Cleveland, you are recognized for your motion. Representative: Thank you Mr. Chairman. Favorable report on the proposed committee substitute to house bill 157, unfavorable to the original. Speaker: I do not believe this is a PCS, is it? Okay. You have heard the motion. All those in favor, signify by saying aye [aye], opposed, say nay [silence]. Bill is agreed to, thank you. Next we will call up house bill 844, modern state human resources management. Representative Collins is recognized. There is a PCS. I think they made the copies and got the PCS passed out. We will hold on that for just a moment Representative Collins. Next bill we will take up is house bill 691, limit soldiers community college tuition. You should have that one. The PCS should be at your desk. The PCS is not? There is no PCS for this bill. The gentleman is recognized to present the bill. Representative: Thank you MR. Chairman. The bill summary on this explains exactly what this bill does. This addresses the issue of soldiers, marines, that start their community college education in NC, and will transfer to some other place. Often, they are in wartime status and will be deployed over seas, and will not be allowed to continue that because they are in a war zone. They come back to the U.S. and they are not in NC. They want to continue their education in NC, and are charged the out of pocket tuition rate, which is fine. The department of defense will reimburse them for $250 rather than credit rate of $262. What this bill simply does is say that for those soldiers, marines, airmen: any service member that fits in that category and wants to complete their community college degree online with the state of NC, then we will forgive that $10 or $12 differential. There is a fiscal [xx], you can pull it up on your computers. This is really an opportunity cost. If people

who are eligible for this actually do it, the state will make money. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mr. Chair. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Representative Floyd. [SPEAKER CHANGES] At the appropriate time. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Well, let's let the bill sponsor finish the explanation. If you'll continue, Representative Szoka. [SPEAKER CHANGES] But I can take a hint, and this is probably an appropriate time, so if there are no questions. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] You're through? You're ready? Representative Floyd is recognized. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Move for a favorable report for House Bill 691. [SPEAKER CHANGES] You've heard the motion. Further discussion; further debate? Seeing none, all those in favor of the motion please signify by saying aye. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Aye. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Opposed no. And the bill is agreed to; thank you. Committee will be at ease for a moment. I believe the next bill is being passed out. Hose Bill 560. Economical School Bus Replacement Criteria. Representative Arp will be recognized to explain the bill. This bill is before the committee for discussion purposes only at this time, and Representative Arp is recognized to present his bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. What this bill does is simply changes the way we procure school buses. Before, there was no defined terms. DPI used a system of good criteria, but it was mainly just funded as a line item, and there was really no criteria in the budget that was established to do this. What we did was we looked at a couple of different ways- we worked with DPI in developing this, and this is a tiered approach in the sense that, what it says is a bus is eligible for replacement when it's 20 years old or has 250,000 miles, but it has two exceptions. A bus less than 150,000 miles must remain in service until it's at

Least 20 years old and up from beyond 20 years until reaching 150,000 miles to that must have at least 150,000 miles are more info box is less than 15 years old and has to go 300,000 miles one of the things that some of that we've got is to make sure that the bosses the bill have an undue burden on their we put in place party of five for 30 bosses that the deep dark in use for a case of Perot structural failure or aging failure special condition today and one other thing is really are interested in the lobbyists they actually provides and sue death so that the daily eight but declined to replace the memo boss that needs to replace the criteria ,(SPEAKER CHANGES) he chooses to run the Boston this deal of years past the head of minimal they would receive an incentive payment of $2000 per box for your an award to do whatever they want to assign restricted funds to go back to the highly eight no bias may run longer than 23 years and(SPEAKER CHANGES) I am working with DP out what we did was put in the grandfathering clause that says, that for the next two years were on hold for most of the boxes that they had intended to replace a decision still provides a message stating that hurry what's a small alienates the fiscal month on this deal, use is significant, by simply changing the way we prick your we will say $172.5 million $285.1 million over five years on the $572.5 billion 280 followers five years in the next two years we save $67.5 million to $70.8 million when the things they were to do without the bill does is proposed to set up a stop on a camera system to grant program that funds and the monies to fall and stop on camera was that Kelly A skip live four and put cameras on the bosses out the savings so that the that they can nine, more robust way of five prosecuting stop on by wages of people pass to stop school buses on we've had over four fidelity's five Michael and easiest year of people's taxes stop school bus is the latest one and 4 feet away was an April 24 and saint two county out of a young person was with keel and service on redirect some money to settle grant program that valley's can apply a four GB debt and a reward for the first of the bill's sponsor episode of our buying this challenge, as some are billed as a transportation plan Russian four,(SPEAKER CHANGES) still the investigation of this bill does not intend a chance to develop public a motion for a project will call the spill we're just discussion only has to be the person is called for the man, from what you get a lemon-five from nowhere, Kari when running out of Modesto Lemans 100 feet down the Lego blocks that you choose, make 300,000 miles that is correct in what this does give some rather than having a one shot off where wouldn't say when replace all boxes at 250,000 miles this creates a matrix so it works on both page and knowledge the Gaels are districts are so different that crawls across the state com if you do not familiar what happens is the local Elyseés buys the initial Boston in the state replaces them as they wear out and got you here working with EDI week we have party bosses that are available in case you have read that when they can be used to modify the criteria that the use of the gods of discretion to get an obsessed exactly the case to talk about the health of sufficient Mr. Sanford marks the citadel sponsored the yes column as a marquee names used ??.........

C5 nonreligious matters for the distance and from school which would be talk about homework, right foot and Daniel Newton says some affection question I think if you look for defending the bill, the Sooners of subsection. But with just a question that you have a concern that you have the students prevented from engaging in these actions have been friends, write to the school to maintain order and discipline from a string of disruption of the educational process are undermining educational curriculum assignments to think that was so if we inserted to try to protect from the situation, and tried to show the land price 9 to 5 AM ?? (SPEAKER CHANGES) senators signed with his talking about a week ago that the issue but it's not what I'll accept that this is a restatement, Walter call someone in authority on its assistance with stasis and sponsors say all except that when think that that we opted instead to teachers and schools don't really understand the role that's the problem is so that the billions accounts in the second and talk about god everything else that religious of so that we're doing areas would you say what the law is so that the teachers and the taxable since over the next level, Wallace and not violate 55 551 more set by mike, slowing the follicles subsection VIUS Senator Daniel refers to a steady just to see if this were in a accurately and assisted living to be a drafters are understaffed and classes assume that may be prohibited from AG in the things they were just discussing when you can express charities believes that Phyllis would infringe on the rights of the school's two I get too entrenched on the rights of the schools to prevent the sale of a doubly where they can use a blackout at what some ISPs and what it means that the study on the same value one, so it's tough to Karen morrow that that I think S.F. actions at the CSF dispatcher tobacco and calculus lecturer and then CD, applying for any calculus responses CHS to CNN's brain classics and a L a D considered an entrenched MIT determine the education curriculum assignments and prevent destruction of the educational process L De CV CARB appropriate time for them to be that good thing about happiness response instead, send them into the NFL notice that she was named Michelle gift to the learning process are there crying or standing then 9:00 PM (SPEAKER CHANGES) and signal airline had been removed from the classroom and they may even be suspended from school so you cannot ever get away from that folks whether Dylan was not disrupt the lighting process all, he's got to be done so only if the momentum and scary, said about Islam will follow the way to make shoelaces about a four R good staff and faculty in the schools actions two from prevent disruption than determined that, to attack until Scandinavia's examples supported and come back a solid C S's Weil flat to slightly sure we are going to be a history that money at teachers and principals and risk you would think that this would step us left there that ms represented by an Italian specific image and he suspended emerging speech cases that regards to schools sound and probably are the phrase in such a caring for the schoolhouse door by the schools to have the ability to maintain order and discipline and cannot fully exercised their exit from the school Saint Anthony A chair and purpose of public schools that thank you think you I think we will move now to the public sector and 92, speakers and sign that the Mayor Marc fisher's first and 9:00 PM and 577-9297 no sudden on lecture no matter, to remind down the floor 90 THS chairman, Rev. mark reach executive director of the Christian action league North Carolina Goldberg of the myriad of problems facing our schools today matters ranging from comes to drugs but the real problem six students face had little to do with what's in the students had little to do with what's in the students are and nothing is as effective in dealing with matters about five more than the practice of things more specifically the practice of prayer ??.....

Representative Torbett moves that the PCS be before the committee for discussion purposes. Without objection. Representative West is recognized for a motion. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I move that we give the proposed committee substitute for House Bill 27 a favorable report. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Discussion and debate. Hearing none, all those in favor of motion please signify by saying aye. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Aye. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Opposed no. And the motion is agreed to. Next bill we’ll take up is House bill 834, modern state human resources management. You should have the PCS in front of you for this. And Representative Shepard moves that it be before the committee for discussion purposes without objection. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mr. Chairman, could you identify the bill we’re on again please. [SPEAKER CHANGES] It is House bill 834, modern state human resources management. Representative Collins is recognized to explain the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I’ll go through this as quickly as possible. This is a long bill. We’ve been working on it for a long time, meeting with all of the stakeholder groups for a long time. But I think I can make the major changes in this fairly easy to understand. If you look on page one, for official purposes of the OSP, the Office of State Personnel is no longer going to be classified under the department of the administration, it’ll report straight to the Governor. Functionally they’ve been doing this already. This is more an official matter than anything else. Under section 1.2, on about line 26, the whole reason that our director Neil Alexander wants this bill is so that he can improve HR at all levels. And so the line here just asks things like they want to improve human relations up and down the food chain so to speak, performance management and so forth, to make the job environment as friendly as possible. If you look on page 2, the change on line five is that every year state employees will have at least 12 holidays. It used to be either 11 or 12 depending on when Christmas fell. Again our new personnel director felt like it shouldn’t matter when Christmas falls, should get the same number of guaranteed holidays each year. So there’s that change. Part 2 deals with state personnel commission. There’s two slight changes here as far as qualification and so forth. There are still four public employees on this commission as there have been. These changes are minor. On page four, under part 3, career status has been shortened and has been made consistent to 12 months. As I understand it, and some of you probably understand this better than I do, some things used to vest in 12 months, some in 24, some in 60. Now basically you’re a career employee at the end of 12 months. Section 4 we’re raising the number of exempt positions from 1,000 to 1,500 and adding three offices which in the past could not have any exempt employees and those are on page 5. The office of information technology, the office of state management and budget, the office of state personnel itself. We’ll have an amendment in just a minute on section 4.5. Down at the bottom of page 5 is where we made a change since we presented this bill to state personnel last week. I promised I would work on this, to our state employees association. We did it and got the change that they wanted which changes it back to your riff rights, basically you have unless you accept or reject a job of equal or higher pay. The bill before us said it could happen even if you were offered a job of lower pay, but we struck that and took it back to what it is today. On page 6, this explains the grievance process. It’s kind of long and involved, we made a concession here also, seeing that originally the department wanted to stay inside the state personnel office and state personnel commission, no for control as much as for timing because right now it’s taking a very long time to get these things heard. We’re hearing as much as 450 days, and all state personnel want to streamline this process. We did bring OAH back in at the request of the state employees association. The way it works basically right now is you state your problem to your supervisor, if you don’t get any satisfaction there line 15 and 16, you grieve it to your agency, if you don’t get any satisfaction there, line 19 you grieve it to the state personnel commission. A hearing officer is appointed by the office of state personnel. That hearing officer makes a report within 60 days and a recommendation to the state personnel office. Line 28, if the state personnel commission, they can do whatever they want too. Accept, reject, or modify what the hearing officer has said. They can issue their own findings. Line 30, the state personnel commission is subject to review by the office of administrative hearings. They have 60 days to either reverse or affirm the decision that has been made there. In line 39, if you don’t like what you got from the office of…

On the men fighting spirit ?? (SPEAKER CHANGES)home page all plates nine of their sole all allowed 35 am following the talks about the commission is discretion by using alternative dispute resolution to play some are repulsed by midday of their view is a little of things to mediation and this is probably the first woman all page 11 down in the bottom line 40 to 43, they brought it up to date set by adding disability and genetic information assigned to get used to discriminate against people by so that was bringing the focus the cream of all places 7.2 with sorts of Bombay, goes the place will buy sleeve is the part of flexibility and training so the training can be done either of the list the level of the agency level section 7.3 straight lines and reporting requirements and at the top of page 13 I we had something here because they employ association wanted to make explicit that some of the agency determines that some on employees follows incorrect the policies of the following why did they write a letter saying that's not correct whatever is in sound is incorrect it's taken out of the employees from 6 to 7.5 is always the director of the authority to give his agency people the sites like the building of the hassle with reporting north beach because(SPEAKER CHANGES) I was on these reports and required are the easiest in the past are really necessary and all and end all page four came on Texas employs seven someone they both deals with reporting features again take a 7.97 moves all about reporting case to a new statute that final place 14 is safe and eighth and all we're trying to get beyond this trade Brands be a party to restructure and reorganize based on function rather than number of positions on and more to do this section 8.2137, brilliant it's a mess of the artsy or other organization for reductions shall be one option available for reorganization restructuring our viewers authorized to serve as an employee voluntary separation program that is the following year on a few rebounds starting on line 44 races still a viable the 40 yards and a published poet complete reorganization goals and its Allies also very important thing to those listed by the spill was 150 and 51 of the sport is taking on becomes law expires December 31, 2014 on November 14 ladies breakdown of a character bobsleigh company on summer ƒthe employees of some fun to Clinton and a really low blocks a unit of really like to take his party or slowing down your audience four years or eight years whenever we're not found three golden parachutes to codify expires in 24 things that can be used for that purpose and they'll play 15 call this section 9.1 city on again are under gentler world, basically says anywhere we saying state personnel and a password and save human resources 14, knowledge and that is the bill are some college and take the first thing we want to do is to take the amendments in the first amendment we have compassion to they'll are six version three the number one Representative Adams are some of them Seuss recognize two, and raising our men call Fuhrman bank and this year and then that isn't very simple men and women got too many changes the effective date of June 30 which means it grandfather's Sunday when it went and had applied to June 30 and did it like a tax Atty. and pulleys and instead of passwords with no full of cool arson colleges recognized like the last person drafted this bill is still speaking ??..........

Listeners to staff those recognized the spigot recognized explain human I plan to miss two speaking of that community is effectively and modifying the process for declaring sections of that section the bill increases for 1015, could also can be declared said, come in under 57 with 26 S file an appeal within 6 to 5 B-Lucerne of the employment opportunities for folks affected by the change and cemented a sleepless off those changes until 2:30 AM makes that perspective two people hide on the after that date so that area police in place would maintain the west and colonel future highs will have a difference it cannot be reduced to severance, were sent off to a frightfully but if all we were robberies into this legislation with all those most of the case already and this is my six-foot homer in favor of the early discussion and debate on the amendment say nine?? (SPEAKER CHANGES) sue gray with the amendment to grow four members and Adams please signify 179 pole placement guys have it in the amendment is agreed to a second amendment that we have ours is so they'll word bench 882 percent of colleges recognize 2% in the displays the discussions with a call for section 4.5 from July 1 by Dr. First issue in discussion today on the amendment saying nine call those in favor of a man and please the signify what should I hold those serving the guy seven and the amendment package agreed to our back to the main bill discussion and debate percent of its peers, taking the state chairmen to me at AME like you would like to comment on the spill into complex L defects alive people and Nike is to say that you would like to comment on the appreciated getting recognized the bill has been through the subject area committee on what we're really doing is a mailing the preparations were also a more available to handle amendments were to take questions from the committee on a page from further questions represented speciality and the chaos and confusion not attend the biggest passed an amendment 148-5121 to rewrite it, as another one to rewrite again a arsenic,(SPEAKER CHANGES) it's actually the second one was a subsection under that section of the lead the second the second amendment basically slates that the Yom department heads and so forth have until October 1 round and was the first to offer similar to all this out all those exact position for wouldn't hurt the first amendment below, width of the year in your rights as a senior employee of the deal to such matters although balsam fall under the site of safety is section was a different subject is to share vs. Michelle when we take the amendment, ski free when we take the motion to approve the of bill will take it with a cadre of of staff harmonizing the Dea amendments are set of four or motions chairman don't recognize first blush that he was chairman of the movie that the house built a 34 proposed the steps to the Anza mandated and incorporating the word to you as a percent the harmonious on the dates , would be a PM in that role in two of the PCs to two years , and reports by Abel an unplayable to the original you have heard the motion further discussion for the arts and the best of intentions to me when the appropriations bill we haven't officially opening the matches the cost, said which packages and cleaning and long-term care dispute resolution procedures remain having numbers Olympics, call 6% columns belief is full of billy fiscal sleight ??......

Those in the mail basically saying that the governor's office has two accomplices of money to the general assembly has appropriated one door to the preparations for the further questions for discussion for the debate you refer demotion on the bill will lose in favor signify the same nine oppose the end the bill has agreed to pay the senate banking committee makes trouble forced his house bill 269 children with disabilities scholarship grants should have a PCs Richard S that in (SPEAKER CHANGES) Representative Michael rath news that the PCs be properly before the committee for discussion purposes without objection of a high as five shares as corrected vision of PCs are descendants shortened his recognize 2% of the taking of the agenda committee members of hospital to 69 is another that an indication from despite our children not interchangeable parts they have five different abilities different disabilities and house bill 269 on creates a special education scholarship grants for children with disabilities following one less sessions passage of the house bill 344 which was a tax credit house bill 269 for repeal the current tax credits are shown with disabilities and create a special education scholarship grants on with grants of not more than 3000 per semester eligible students are reimbursed with tuition and special education and related expenses be eligible but you have to be under the age of 22 to me all the following requirements may require an individualized education plan might be the receive special education services on a ruling on a daily basis but not been placed in the nonpublic school,(SPEAKER CHANGES) but since the end public expense agnostic eight, and rolled in a postsecondary institutions a fulltime student but not receive a high school diploma and they meet one of the following requirements either they were enrolled in the north, public school during the previous semester or they receive special education services for the north, public schools as a preschool trolling with a disability during the previous semester or they receive a scholarship grants to the previous semester or tax credits for the fall semester the 20001314 year or they're eligible from roam in kindergarten and first grade to the success of number requirements and we only get the children was with disabilities to deal with this on at this point in the handed over to represent a greater rigid stand like me, is one in two of the further details of a canoe secured, who offered, but the commission chair who will resume on the west to your review the sense that they can secure group purpose of this bill Hartley, was injured list was talking about is that we could pass a very similar bill in the previous session of what we found was that maybe the kids that really needed walls was not eligible because of the way that we structured in 2000 dow will be watching out for you today is on if you don't actually played the personal income tax which was most kids on the ability to bring in our goal to pull on for having done for having the ??....

not paying the personal income tax, so i really hope that we can do like we did last session. this is basically a bill that passed unannimously on the senete. i think maybe or 6 people voted against it in the house. we want to give everybody the oppertuneity to have the high quality education regardless of their income bracket espeisully kids with speacial needs. i think its been demostrated at time and time again about how about how important it is that we make sure that their adequate environment and this bill does that and i would apprieciate the support of the commttee [speaker change] very briefly, in the last 2 committee it's been an education and finance and all of the discussion have been on the underline law rather then the new law. the new law is as it says just making this available to lower income parents. however i am for your information i am working with ??? ???. on a slight amendment regaurding accountability to make sure that the state education assistance athority recieves documentation that the child is actually recieving special education related services. since we are in appropriations ill address that very briefly this will adverage about three million dollars a year according to the physical note, and it will not of course go into effect under ???? c until the main budget bill passes, in other words you'll get another swipe at it on the budget itself. but this is the policy piece. we'll be glad to answer questions [speaker change] representative gram is very good to us for question, ?? or comment thank ms chair for a comment[speaker change] as a special educator and a special education direct formal special direct us poor, this policy i support that because i had a number of oppertunities to talk to parent with special needs and one is something more in terms as an option for them to have their child's needs met as a special needs students. the state department does a great job with providing services for these children an excellent job provide excellent oppertunities. i do now there are children out there and certian situations that requires something spiecial. and obviously we have special education. there are schools out there who have the desires the needs and the resources to provide services to special needs students in a private setting. i've experienced those, i've had experiences with those facilities that wanted to extend there hand out to those students. this policy gives thse parents an option to pursue that. as a utilateral decision it's not an I.E.P. that's a parent decision, and with that in mind i do support this legislation, thank you. [speaker change] that you representative michele is reconized [speaker change] yeah i question ms chairman of somebody. the last time we discuss this bill in education, i found out this was a refundable ammount of money is it still in that posture? [speaker change] this is a grant, so it's no longer attached credit so the term refundable is not relevent. but it is, you do not have to be wealthy to get. this this is available to every child who is what we used to call handy cap and now disabled. who has an I.E.P. [speaker change] representative insco [speaker change] thank you mister chairman ladies and gentle man of the committee. 3 thousand dollars per semester does not come close to covering the expenses for special education child who needs extra help. those of you who are in this committee have to have people in your family or your nieghbors, or chidren that you know who have attended schools that do a good job that have the staff and the class of 4 or 5 to one per teacher in order to meet the needs of these special education children, that tuition will be at least 10 thousand dollars per semester sometimes more 3 thousand dollars a semester does not come close to helping a poor family meet the needs of these children and i can'nt vote for these bills. they just are not accomplishing what there supposed to be accomplishing in there taking money away from

of the public system, the public system is underfunded we need to be pouring more money into the public system so that every child who has a special need would have access to the services, not just the families that can afford to supplement a $3000 per semester scholarship with their own funds. So I would, I, we need to do it right and I'm, I hope you'll vote against this bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Representative Horn is recognized [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you Mr. Chairman. I just understand the fiscal impact here, we're moving from one system to another, from a credit to a voucher, lack of a better term. What's the net transfer of money? [SPEAKER CHANGES] Uh the net yes, in the next fiscal year 3.7 million, in the 2nd year of the buy-in 2.8 million and in the subsequent years it averages about 2.3 million. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Just follow up, just so I understand, that's above what we're presently spending, on the current children with disabilities program? [SPEAKER CHANGES] I'm gonna hand you the fiscal note that's [SPEAKER CHANGES] Well, I'm looking at it online I'm just trying to ensure that I and everyone else here understands. [SPEAKER CHANGES] That's my understanding. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Representative Hurley is recognized. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you Mr. Chair, I have a question about the grant process. Is it a simple process or is it difficult? And also what if they don't have internet access? [SPEAKER CHANGES] Well they don't have to have internet access, it's fairly simple. It's on page 2 it's done by the state education assistance authority, which has been in existence for decades. With regard to college grants and loans the SEAA will take a 2% administrative fee, and then in the first year they get a little extra to gear up for it because they will have SEAA will have cost in examining the receipts and the documentation to make sure the children are actually receiving the special services but it's first come first serve unless you were already in it the prior year and you have to have an IEP that you receive in the public schools. So the public school is the gatekeeper for eligibility and then every 3 years, you have to be reevaluate… the child has to be reevaluated in the public school, but that expense is covered in this bill, to make sure they are still qualified to receive the grant. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Representative Richardson is recognized [SPEAKER CHANGES] Yes I have a question on line on page 2, line 12, it says that the eligible student awarded grants may not be enrolled in public school, and then when we move down to line 26 that they have to be reevaluated by the local education agency. Is that the school where they would have gone and is there any additional money being given to that school, to bring that child back to have them reevaluated? [SPEAKER CHANGES] The money for that is in the bill in the fiscal note through DPI. I don't know that it has to be at the exact school but the money is covered in the appropriations so it doesn't come out of the budget of that particular school. But they have to return for the purpose of revaluation, through the public school system, for just that revaluation. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Follow up [SPEAKER CHANGES] So who would be responsible for transporting the student to the school, for the evaluation? I'm over here. Over here, over here. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Oh, I'm sorry. Never could find you. [SPEAKER CHANGES] That's ok. So who would be responsible for transporting the student back to the school or how where would the child be tested, in the school, at home, or where? [SPEAKER CHANGES] Well the parent would take them to the school, or wherever the school directs, they'd be taken, that's.. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Representative Goodman is recognized. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you Mr. Chairman. I have a question or a clarification from the bill sponsor. They way I understand this, under current law, those with enough taxable income already receive this benefit, all this does is expands it to those who are not, who do not have enough income to receive it, so that might be helpful to representative Insko, it does not… [SPEAKER CHANGES] Yeah, you hit the nail on the head. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Alright, thank you very much.

The full strength as the banking Mr. Chairman does not end stages, questioned its economy and a we keep hearing all (SPEAKER CHANGES) about the public school system should take care of SM to break said they do a good job but in economies of scale when you have are C and scattered throughout the system under Canada’s been a lot of money to store each won the most actively brisk and seven option to go to a facility that is a home here courts that needs of their column N you have the professionals who died of a disability and how to work with tens MM not knocking the public school system's ability to get back the thing from a military standpoint were focused HK send back the parents have is an option is definitely beneficial home to the system as well as to the family's concern percent of the show's recognized I just have to accommodate two home: and in particular?? (SPEAKER CHANGES) the representatives ?? mention, standing the EU you got $3000 scholarship given to look into transfer of which with the IE P of country and the guy who won the few going for as little pride against two, addition to which we've got a call to wish to two after racing is 10 to 12,000 dollars a year of hell, while the ballot for that to wishing company is in the call for special, Judge Stephen V Letitia clinic where is the calls from that school and I never really knew what it calls coming in and take care of , will simply next question, concern that is a question for a lot of folks and I will say that on parents who were looking for school is a special event of a job with special be a smuggler said Eric Stoltz (SPEAKER CHANGES) moved to apply for its not adequate and nominated it does not adequately with the state public schools referring so nobody would actually go and pay money for something less adequate and, as far as to the head of the $3000 to $50,000 closer than they were to four and I think that, Julie with oracle let you know that the only passes to last year , to two years ago that the line without the board of parents to walkers choice is not up to represent Brandon was showing by the health to determine what that means preparing to practice record stores and that's what this bill is a balance of data five.(SPEAKER CHANGES) Actress… Adequate for them to Mr. Chiles, MMM, five hard to believe that somebody would make an inadequate solution pay for it represented a string of bank in this year's district, may well depend on film and amid concern that we had some billing in education, and allows anyone give parents to lessen the pain that is the chiles but when you talking about the poorest of payments reports of children and men, because it happens again, the install if they don't have the ballot that would test and the common law two enabled the poorest of the film in the poorest of the spec families to be able to anticipate SYAS find a way and will they get access to the bowels of the FB realistic about it, it puts and calls a backlash that is not enough if they don't have the money to make up the difference and I think we just need to be no mistake about this will end up helping these children if they want to go with a password that ago they don't have the dow was to go urging the best growers recognized that the key is to 22 questions , GSM 115C112 22 definitions section said six and two C A explain the way has not been placed in a nonpublic school facility about public agency a public expense means yes on in the some public schools are actually mail pay for private school for special needs kids when they pay 50,000 other innovative still have something there are those two will set the one to 5008 ??..........

So this is just to prevent double dipping beaus if they’re already being paid for by the county they don’t get an extra six thousand dollars a year. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Follow up. Yes sir. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGES]I appreciate the effort here I just have one question. If we’re trying to change the current status by allowing lower economic status families the opportunity to get this scholarship why we are then still giving priority to the folks that had the scholarship last time? Why wouldn’t everybody enter the pot equally starting here forward? [SPEAKER CHANGES]Representative Baskerville I appreciate your question. The reason is that if your child is already in the program for continuity purposes we don’t want to take them out of the program they’re already in the school, they’re already learning we don’t want to say hey sorry you don’t get it this year and then they have to go back to another school. Just for continuity purposes, if you’re in it you’re in it and you’re grandfathered in. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Representative Blackwell is recognized. [SPEAKER CHANGES]Thank you Mr. Chairman I wanted to ask about two scenarios to clarify for myself that I understand how this would work. Let me ask either the bill sponsors or staff. Let’s say we’re dealing with a third grader who is involved in public school and is in special-ed and otherwise meets the eligibility requirements. He’s been there. As I understand it, that student would be eligible for this three thousand dollar per semester grant that would allow him to withdraw from the public school and go to a non-public school assuming that is what occurs, would LEA losing him to the non-public school not have its AVM reduced by that one slot so that the LEA would receive fewer dollars from the state since it would have fewer students. And would that dollar amount that the LEA lost not exceed the six thousand dollar annual cost of the grant. [SPEAKER CHANGES]They would lose the cost as well as the resource but as I understand it unless you’ve exceeded the twelve percent cap on special need kids the extra amount is like net three thousand a year so in the scenarios I've seen in fiscal notes for the underlying program. For every child who does this there is a saving to the state so I don’t see how the state loses on this. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Follow up [SPEAKER CHANGES] Follow up [SPEAKER CHANGES] Well that’s I think my point Representative Stam, as I understand the way this is going to work the six thousand dollars is less than the money that the state will save for each student withdrawing from the public school and going to the non-public school where we would be spending less money is that not correct? [SPEAKER CHANGES] That’s correct but some children can come in at kindergarten or for first grade and perhaps they would have gone to the private school anyway so there’s a balancing of costs and expenses but under the. I’m sorry.[SPEAKER CHANGES] That’s alright. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Final follow up if I may. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Brief follow up yes sir. [SPEAKER CHANGES] And that was my second scenario I wanted to ask about with the exception of what those children who might otherwise have gone to private school anyway there also would be a savings to the state for each of these kindergartners entering into a nonpublic school that we would not need to fund at the LEA level. Is that not correct? [SPEAKER CHANGES]That’s correct although to balance that there are some kindergartners, first graders who might have gone to private school anyway so they basically balance but not exactly. [SPEAKER CHANGES]Representative McElraft is recognized for a brief comment or question. [SPEAKER CHANGES]Brief. I would just like to say I think its very sad that we would actually think about not doing this for the poorest of our poor and giving them opportunity. Who’s to say that there’s not some business out there that would supplement that three thousand dollars. Who’s to say that that school might find

Another scholarship to help. Why not give them the opportunity. I've seen people in my district that are frustrated with the way they are being treated in some of the school systems. Their children, they don't feel are getting the proper care that they need for that special disability, so if there is a school that they would get better care, why not give them the opportunity. The same as someone who can afford to pay for it themselves. I think that we should be ashamed of ourselves if we don't give it to the poorest of the poor. [SPEAKER CHANGE] All right. We are running down on our time, because we have to be out of here by 10 til. I believe Representative James Graham has a motion. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Mr. Chairman. I'd just like to ask one question. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Well, lets take the motion and then we'll have further discussion, further debate. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Just one question . . . [SPEAKER CHANGE] Oh, you have a question. [SPEAKER CHANGE] To Representative Stan. Representative Stan, is there anything in this bill that eliminates the responsibility for the public school system to pay for that tuition once that child enrolls in a private school? [SPEAKER CHANGE] I was informed by staff that that's automatic. We don't specifically say it, but thats my understanding. [SPEAKER CHANGE] A motion, Mr. Chair. [SPEAKER CHANGE] The gentleman is recognized. [SPEAKER CHANGE] I move for a favorable to the PCS for House Bill 269, unfavorable to the original. [SPEAKER CHANGE] You've heard the motion for favorable report to the proposed committee substitute for House Bill 269, for the committee substitute House Bill 269 unfavorable as to the original. Further discussion, further debate? Representative Richardson, actually had her hand up for a very brief comment or question. [SPEAKER CHANGE] I just wanted to know, is there anything in this bill that a parent would waive his or her right to a free appropriate education as mandated by IDEA? [SPEAKER CHANGE] If one of the sponsors would answer that, briefly. [SPEAKER CHANGE] No. They could come back in the next day. [SPEAKER CHANGE] What do you mean come back . . . Follow up? [SPEAKER CHANGE] We don't have time, I want to get to Representative ??. [SPEAKER CHANGE] I will just say, with further debate and opportunity, I will ask more questions about accountability so that we know that these children are actually getting the education they need in a school they attend. But, my question is would the bill sponsors accept an amendment for this to be merit based to people who are at the 300% of the federal poverty or lower? Would you accept that amendment? [SPEAKER CHANGE] That discussion can be held with the bill sponsors after the committee. We have a motion for a favorable report, for the proposed committee substitute before the committee. All those in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Aye. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Opposed no. [SPEAKER CHANGE] The ayes have it and the motion is agreed to. And, we will be back in here, probably, a little after 5:00 this afternoon to finish the balance of our bills and partake of a couple more.