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Senate | March 5, 2013 | Chamber | Session

Full MP3 Audio File

Senate will come to order. Sergeant-at-arms will close the doors. Members will go to their seats. Members and guests of the gallery, please silence all your electronic devices. Leading the Senate in prayer is the Reverend Peter Milnerson, a chaplain. All members and guests of the gallery will please stand. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Let's pray. Lord, thanks for the life, for the buzz in the room, for the energy. These nurses that are here today in great numbers, we thank you for what they do. How they help us when we're bad and we need help. Lord, you've blessed us time and time again. You've blessed us through prophets, priests and through your holy word. But we plead with you Lord, Father to continue to encourage these servants you've assembled as they wrestle with decisions, as they wrestle with issues, shower down upon them your blessings. Bless them, Jesus. Bless us, Jesus. Amen. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Berger is recognized for a motion. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you, Mr. President. The Journal of Monday, March 4, 2013 has been examined. It has been found to be correct. I move that we dispense with the reading of the Journal and that it stand approved as written. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Without objection, the Journal for Monday, March 4 stands approved as written. Senators, we have a nurse of the day with us today. Andrea Underwood from Hamptonville, North Carolina. Andrea if you'd please stand and be recognized. Thank you for your service to the Senate. On the motion of Senator Kathy Harrington of Gaston County, the chair is happy to extend courtesies to Lianne McMillan, Jonathan Fletcher, Corey Bryson and Daniel Ware. Thank you for being with us today. If you're here, please stand. On the motion of Senator Michael Walters of Robeson County, the chair is happy to extend courtesies to Robeson Community College, UNC-Pembroke, and Southeastern Medical Center - about 50 strong today. If you're here with us, please stand and be recognized. Reports of standing committees. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mr. President [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Brock, for what purpose do you rise? [SPEAKER CHANGES] To send forth a committee report. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator, you can send forth your report. Clerk will read. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Brock from the Agriculture and Environmental and Natural Resources Committee ?? Senate Bill 24 ?? Committee Substitute Bill titled: The Act to Amend the Gameland Buffer Requiring Applications for Certain New Sanitary Landfills. Senate Bill 58: Increase Funding for ?? Substitute Bill. Senate Bill 113 ?? support for regional water supply system: favorable. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senate Bill 24, calendar. Senate Bill 58, finance. Senate Bill 113, calendar. Senate Goolsby, for what purpose do you rise? [SPEAKER CHANGES] Send forth a committee report, Mr. President. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Please send forth your report, Senator. Clerk will read. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Goolsby, for the Judiciary One Committee, submits the passage of Senate Bill 45 in capacity to proceed. Amendments favorable [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senate Bill 45, calendar.

him. your part messages from house to best front I have sadly, I can't have to many steps do number two, an act to establish a government reduction and efficiency act of twenty thirteen receiver concurrence house committee substitute number two [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mr. present throughout the public Euros a motion policed solely for promotion president does is reticent until canceled cards and left the house has to default ports for immediate consideration to you a beautiful building, Seo consultant, thank you so different requirements on objections were ordered as soon as we remove directly to the calendar with us in a built-in Oracle read should be okay Senate bill no. ten . I may set their number to an act establishing a government reduction in efficiency act of twenty thirteen. the roundabout will procure us speak to the motion for costs and reinforcement motion is present members of Moradabad and make copies of this bill passes out. I asked their body is not to concur what we sent over to the house is not what we got back it is time to put this in some emergency room and have some of the notices either take a look at it simply when I size you not to concur is where you have whose hazard of a All in favor vote aye. All opposed vote no. The clerk will open the vote. The clerk will let the machine record the vote the loop. I know you have a center at and thirty eight in the negative. the house may substitute number two Senate Bill ten fails and the house will be so notified Google back in South America on the Republican bills. the third meeting will call bill, Senate Bill ninety seven. the clerk will read and then I said in fact that the annexation to me, would you like that.anything further on this bill presents assessment for further discussion or debate going on. the question presented is the passage of the committee substitute Senate Bill ninety seven August third reading, all in favor will vote our husband five seconds bailout for the voting work record about All in favor vote aye. All opposed vote no. The clerk will open the vote. The clerk will let the machine record the vote if you have a vote in the fifty affirmative, and zero in the negative. many substance of the old ninety seven passes its third reading and will be sent to the house must present a drop of aquaculture of motion. please send me up for promotion. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mister President, hospital, writing to his next film calendar SUV moved to the end of today's calendar were waiting on a member, an amendment to be perfect sword him, although senators in the second reading of the bill, Senate Bill twenty four. Corey is trying at all. no axon access sooner. millions recognizes window him him him us him. she sent to say this is no question in the Senate have passed on. I met with him and spoken to us/ since I try to know Susan the twenty two thousand and two thousand seven and Donald

27,000 people have died from accidental drug overdoses in 2007. In 16 states overdose deaths exceeded automobile fatalities. These numbers may shock you as it did me when we got the data on this also. Drug overdose is the number 2 injury related killer of young adults ages 15 to 34. Noxalone is a drug that provides life-saving respiratory stimulation. It is given as a nasal or syringe form by prescription. This bill administers ?? immunity from prosecution for individuals who contact authorities with an overdose and limited immunity for administering or prescribing Noxalone. The Sheriff’s Association we have worked several weeks with them to get them comfortable with this bill. Also the Medical Society is fine with this. And most of these drug overdoses, these youth are dead before first responders ever get there. Mr. President , if I may, I will conclude my comments and allow if Senator Allran to for this amendment. If you wish. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Allran, you can have the floor. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you, Mr. President. The amendment is on everyone’s desk if you’ll take a look at that. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator, I didn’t realize we were putting forth an amendment here. I thought you were just going to speak. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I handed it for already but it hasn’t been read. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Do all the members have copies of the amendment? We do? Clerk will read. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Allran moves to amend the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Allran, you are recognized. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you, Mr. President. The addition that you have on your desk provides that Nolaxone can be prescribed, dispensed and distributed. Nolaxone is an FDA approved drug, it’s a regulated drug but it is not a controlled drug. But because it’s a regulated drug it does require prescription to dispense by federal law. The use of the term, or, in the original term that’s on your desk might indicate that it could be dispensed without a prescription being written, and the amendment removes the word dispensed or distributed, from the bill to clarify that the practitioner must still prescribe the bill. That’s what the amendment does and I urge your support. Thank you Senator, is there any further discussion or debate? Hearing none, the question before the Senate is the passage f Amendment 1. All in favor will vote aye, oppose will vote no. Five seconds will be allowed for the voting. The clerk will record the vote. Apodaca, aye. 50 having voted in the affirmative and zero in the negative. Amendment 1 is adopted and the bill as amended is back before the body. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mr. President? [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Randleman, for what purpose do you rise? [SPEAKER CHANGES] Speak to the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator, you have the floor to speak to the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you, Mr. President. Ladies and gentlemen, when a company is looking to locate a business they look at the crime rate and the overall quality of life in our communities. In 2007, Wilkes County ranked the third worse in the nation for drug overdoses. After the implementation of the Lazarus Project, Wilkes county has seen a 69% drop in overdoses from 2009 to 2011. And I would like to read you the mission statement of the Lazarus Project. Lazarus, excuse me, Project Lazarus utilizes experience, data and compassion to empower communities and individuals to prevent drug overdoses. Provide effective substance abuse treatment and meet the needs of those living with chronic pain. The U.S. Army at Fort Bragg dispenses Nolaxone to active duty officers and their families for overdose rescues. And the Eastern Band of the Cherokee Indian reservation does for their residents. So I ask your support on this legislation. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Is there any further discussion or debate? Senator Allran, for what purpose do you rise? [SPEAKER CHANGES] Speak on behalf of the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator, you have the floor to speak to the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I just wanted to say simply that the only point of this piece of legislation is to save lives. Anyone can become addicted to prescription drugs. The drugs that were made.

What we'll be talking about in this bill, which are painkillers or opiates are very widely available in our society. Startling available and highly addictive. As Senator Bingham pointed out, in the United States the number one cause of accidental deaths is prescription drug overdosing. It's number two in North Carolina, after automobile accidents, but if we don't do something about it that's going to change. We discussed this bill very thoroughly in the J2 committee and it got a resounding, unanimous vote out of the J2 committee. The sheriff spoke on behalf of it, the Psychiatrist is in favor of it, medical folks are in favor of it, the military, the Indian reservations, and the Project Lazarus author that Senator Randleman referred to as a minister. Quite frankly, I'm not sure if anybody has yessed this bill and I urge your support. Thank you. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Is there any further discussion or debate? Hearing none, the question before the Senate is the passage of the committee substitute of Senate Bill 20 as amended on a second reading. All in favor vote, aye. All opposed vote, no. Five seconds will be allowed for voting. The clerk will record the vote. Record. By. 50 having voted for the affirmative and zero in the negative. The committee substitute Senate Bill 20 as amended passes second reading without objection. It'll be read a third time. [SPEAKER CHANGE] North Carolina ??. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Any further discussion or debate? Hearing none, all in favor of the passage of substitute Senate Bill 20 as amended will say, aye. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Aye. Opposed, no. The ayes have it and the committee substitute Senate Bill 20 as amended has passed its third reading. The amendment will be engrossed and be sent to the house. Senate Bill 33, the clerk will read. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Senate Bill 33, use of criminal history records by licensing boards. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Senator Hartsell's recognized to explain the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Thank you, Mr. President. Members of the Senate, the bill comes from the administrative procedure oversight committee. It is designed to create and identify or deal with a situation where an applicant or a license with a criminal record, applies for such an occupational license that in the law that does not provide that that record, or that conviction is a specific automatic disqualifier. That the licensing board must consider these factors, that are identified in the bill, when making this decision on the license application. So far as I'm aware there is no opposition to this bill. In fact, it's been endorsed by a number of . . . I think the Sheriff's Association and others. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Any further discussion or debate? Hearing none, the question for the Senate is the passing of committee substitute of Senate Bill 33 on the second reading. All in favor will vote aye. All opposed will vote no. Five seconds will be allowed for the voting. Clerk record the vote. ??. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Aye. 50 having voted in the affirmative and zero in the negative committee substitute Senate Bill 33 passes the second reading without objection. It will be read a third time. [SPEAKER CHANGE] North Carolina ??. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Is there any further discussion or debate? Hearing none, all in favor of the passage of the committee substitute Senate Bill 33 on its third reading will say aye. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Aye. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Opposed, no. The aye's have it. Senate Bill 33 passes it's third reading and will be sent to the House. Senate Bill 91, the clerk will read. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Senate Bill 91, prohibit expungement inquiry. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Senator Daniels is recognized to explain the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGE] Thank you, Mr. President. First of all, I'd like to thank my co-sponsors, Senator Kinnaird and Senator Goolsby for their work with me and with the J2 committee on this bill. We have a principle that the expungement process exists to give people who have made mistakes, early in life in a non-violent way, who were convicted of a non-violent crime to have their record expunged and therefore have better access to employment and other educational opportunities. This bill builds on that premise by prohibited employers and educational institutions from inquiring about an expunged crime that an individual may have had removed from their record. In the context of an employment situation, this bill

him as a civil penalty of up to five hundred dollars and employer were to ask a prospective employee about and expunged it would be administered by the Department of Labor as a backup section one C business is really just making a technical change the previous statues. the Chinese word reverse, vacate him. that's not really the just of the villages of the bill as it is not obviously mentioned to preprinted educational institutions and employers from asking about response times. now if any questions I be glad to answer them on employers that input in this bill• who has made some changes to it and I feel like that this consensus am not aware of any opposition MS for your support preprocessor debate [SPEAKER CHANGES] Further discussion further debate All in favor vote aye. All opposed vote no. The clerk will open the vote. The clerk will let the machine record the vote forty eight, having voted in the affirmative, and two in the negative resources to build ninety one passes. the second reason objection rather time North Carolina, Joachim Mann asked me for this yesterday, if not all in favor. the prosecutors of Susanville, ninety one, on his third ratings. a high cause no All in favor vote aye. All opposed vote no. The clerk will open the vote. The clerk will let the machine record the vote , please just visited all ninety one passes this third reading and will be sent to the house house built eighty two. three two eight two Internal Revenue Code what it shows, recognizes well [SPEAKER CHANGES] thank you so, ladies and gentlemen, the Senate and many of you that were involved in the but meeting the corruption of power is a excellent job in explaining this bill and for some of you are however briefly, what it means. every year the General assembly after the federal government and Congress decides to make a federal law check tax changes out. we usually appease your following on decide whether we either comply. we need to agree with it or did the couple or not to agree with it, and so therefore we are here again, thanks to Congress of making decisions about the two thousand and twelve cashier waiting to live letter to the half the twelfth hour, but basically, January second two thousand and thirteen, making federal tax changes on it delayed us that there are a number of problems. hours that are anxiously waiting to decide how to best put in their tax returns and a lot of communes and attorneys are waiting for also this bill, so hopefully today and tomorrow will get this passed. so they can move out and provide clarity to the runs filing taxes, and when preparing the object of this year was to minimize the general fund impact as much as possible as is been done in the past. that's number of years are the same time minimizing the complexity for taxpayers and for the Department of revenue. just as an example, there are already five hundred thousand tax rate of tax returns in place today. and some of them will have to be readjusted because of the fact that the Congress was so late in the end, preparing upcoming phone of these tax changes so that we tried to do I know well through this yet is so is basically deciding run. if it was sad possible for us to afford ease and second, that if the changes were that were made were so complex that it would require us to go back and have evaluated two thousand twelve in January to come forward with the necessary tax information and it would be almost requiring them to have two sets of books. to do so. so those are the decisions as to how we made it in the decision came down, so that when we ended up doing was the bonus depreciation enhance section one seventy nine. we chose been the couple goes to bat does not mean the businesses don't take advantage of this,what it means is that it will be depreciated over a longer period of time in fifteen

as will fully scroll Costa Rica property. we confirmed with work opportunity tax credit. we confirmed the first year with an adjustment in the second year. once everyone has had time to planaccordingly chose not to continue that the company limitation on itemized deductions. we confirmed education expenses qualified tuition and expenses, actions, we decoupled a student loan interest confirmed income exclusion employer-provided education assistance. we conformed a residence related benefits mortgage insurance premiums, interest, we decoupled income inclusion for the discharge of residence indebtedness. the couple asked redistribution from the IRAs to charities decoupled our income, tax, tax credit. we confirmed with an adjustment in the adjustment on the IPC went from five percent to four. five percent of the federal level which basically made that revenue neutral on the WTC. we went from six percent to three percent, which in essence made that revenue neutral, and in the adoption tax credit. we confirmed with an adjustment going from fifty percent of it to thirty percent of and what we tried to do is reduce the impact in the general fund of the first year was twenty five million dollars in the second year we reduced it to eighteen million dollars, so they would be sufficient amount of dollars for us to meet our needs in education and elsewhere. that being said I would urge each of the members of the Senate to support House Bill eighty two and the ticket voting out so that we can provide some clarity to the taxpayers in order to him prepare his will assist them in getting this next job done Friday April fifty. thank you [SPEAKER CHANGES] further discussion further debate of the• fabric or procure us back to some form member Charles remembers up copy•they should have been distributed by now, you can support your member Center. [SPEAKER CHANGES] I believe the postal clerk has even provoked Grigori if I remember Bill 's of thousands of it. luckily recognize explained a member of the fastest present I I guess I will show in a regular, hard-working and not difficult circumstances you more so as he says in five years because of the very light date on which Congress chose to ask change VRC in the limited amount of time that that's given us your North Carolina two to respond that I appreciate the hard work that they have done and not politically young appeal together on as I thought about the build over the weekend I I I took a look again at some of the particular things, shows to do and reflected on the fact that a lot of the provisions that we are in this bill as proposed, choosing not to conform to not follow are really useful tools in the present economy to support the additional job creation and support working families in the present economy as we continue to labor to get out of the Dutch and I I* took a different view that although the latest troubles me as a dozen Araujo still think some of the decisions were made by Congress, or are good onesfor our state and so I offer for your consideration. remember that would strike a somewhat different balance about what will how we following how we conform to the Internal Revenue Code, let me say I will expand amendment and you should also have a physical memorandum apparently none that I will also discuss but let me also say that the IV was original completely that we don't need to be in the as you make changes that would be retroactive to twenty twelve, and require you to avoid file the returns to graphical back and amend the return of withdrawing refile return. so, the amendment does not believe that I just like the basic building, said Araujo explained to you all the amendment does, or forward-looking changes that would be for the present tax year. I'm going for out where it differs from him. I has to lead to is in the following respects and if you've got the amendment now I'll tell you where those RC can follow and if you are relate back to the Maysville, you can do that online. as the first of the changes made and what the that amendment portion. remember does is it conforms fully to what Congress did on the extension of the work opportunity tax credit. it does not lower the rate as the bill proposes to do from six percent to three

"Just a refresher about what that work opportunity tax credit does, is it provides employers with a tax credit or a tax incentive for hiring difficult to place employees. Folks coming off of welfare, if your hiring somebody off of the welfare roles. Or hiring an ex felon who's just been discharged from prison. Congress says it's important to try and get employers to do that and gives a tax credit for that. What the amendment purposes to do is to follow and conform under state tax code to that provision that supports the jobs creation for difficult to employee people. The second thing the amendment does, it starts on line 3 of the amendment and runs through line 9. Again what that does is addresses the problem that congress saw with the continuing difficulty we have with the foreclosure situation as people are being foreclosed or they're engaging in short sales and then saddled with enormous forgiveness of debt which they have to pay income tax on because it's treated as income when the debt is discharged. Congress has said that we ought to allow some slack to those folks who are dealing with foreclosures and short sales and not require them to treat that discharge of debt as income. So what the amendment proposes to do is to continue to conform the internal revenue code on that, in other words North Carolina would do the same thing the feds are doing but it does make one change that is different from the federal change. The amendment would cap the amount of the indebtedness that could be thus excluded from income at 250,000 dollars. The feds go all the way to 2 million dollars. That's a rather expensive house. If you're getting 2 million discharged on your mortgage that's a pretty hefty sum. So the amendment limits that in order to keep the fiscal impact of the amendment down to 250,000 worth of discharge income. The third thing the amendment does and fourth thing, it does two things and they're all shown on line 11. The deletion that's proposed on line 11 affects two provisions of the base bill. The first of those is that it would continue conforming to the internal revenue code which allows you to exclude or deduct amounts you pay for mortgage insurance premiums. Again to try to support the housing industry, to try and support families who are dealing with difficult situations who's lenders are now saddling them with high mortgage insurance premiums because of the credit situation. So again it's supportive of the housing industry and of homeowners who are trying to make their mortgage payments.By continuing to conform to the internal revenues code allowance of that deduction. Second thing that line of the amendment does is it's full conformity on the earned income tax credit. Unlike the tax bill it does not reduce the tax rate or the state tax credit from 5 percent to 4 and a half percent. It conforms to the federal extension of the 5 percent earned income tax credit in North Carolina. So the last thing that this amendment does is it pays for those things. I'll talk in a minute on the fiscal memo on where we bottom out. Here's how it pays for it. That starts on line 13 and continues down to line 24 of the amendment. In the last session we enacted a tax benefit that we were told was to support small business job creation. That tax benefit was to allow employers to exclude from state taxable income for the first 50 thousand dollars of income. All taxpayers could exclude the first 50 thousand dollars worth of business income. That again was sold to us as a way to support small businesses in job creation efforts. Some supported that amendment, so supported that legislation some did not support that legislation. What the amendment does is it caps eligibility for that 50 thousand dollar exclusion at tax payers whose incomes are less than a million dollars. In other words, what the amendment says that if you make more than a million dollars taxable income in North Carolina, you don't get that 50 thousand dollar small business exclusion, if you make more than a million dollars. That's the last thing the amendment does, members should have a fiscal memo that gives you the cost of those items and the revenue changes on each of those items in the amendment. All I'm going to do unless there are questions, Mr. President, is give you the bottom line. If you want to look at the fiscal memo on the amendment, what it shows is the cost of this amendment in the first year is just at 9 million dollars less..." [END]

Then the cost of the bill as filed and presented on the floor. Cost of this amendment is approximately nine million dollars less. In the second year of buying in the cost of the amendment is approximately five million dollars more than the bill that was put on the floor this afternoon. For the biennium for which we did opt in a two year biennial budget in the next month or two, the total cost of this amendment is $38.7 million dollars. The total cost of the bill is $42 million dollars. Over the next biennium the amendment cost the state of North Carolina about three million dollars less than the bill that's on the floor, and in the out years that continues so in each subsequent year the differential cost is about three million dollars less. I misspoke, my apologies, my great apologies to all of you, I gave you the wrong number in the amendment on the $50,000 exclusion. It goes away over $500,000 dollars, not over a million, my apologies. We;re trying to get the numbers to balance and we were working very hard on getting the numbers to balance, they balance at $500,000 dollars so the exclusion goes away over $500, 000 of net taxable income in North Carolina. My apologies in the explanation. Mr. President that's a short statement of the amendment. Again, I think the amendment by and large conforms to an awful lot of the more important provisions that senator Rucho covered with you, but the four adjustments that we make I would urge you to consider because I think they do support working families. Families struggling with housing problems, they support the housing industry and they support job creation. And they cost something to some tax payers, they cost - they're about seven to ten thousand taxpayers in this state of nine million people who might pay more because they won't get a tax benefit we gave them two years ago. I think its a fair balance, it's a good balance for the state's bottom line in terms of state budget. And I hope you'll give favorable consideration of the amendment. Thank you Mr. President. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Is there any further discussion or debate? Senator Rucho. Senator Tucker for what purpose do you rise? [SPEAKER CHANGES] To ask the amendment's sponsor a question. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Clodfelter do you yield for a question? [SPEAKER CHANGES] yes sir. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Just a quick one. So, if we vote for your amendment the tax decrease that we had two years ago, we're going to voting for a tax increase on people making over $500,000 dollars a year. So this is a tax increase? [SPEAKER CHANGES] You will remove - yes Senator Tucker. You will remove the benefit that those people got two years ago, you would also though be granting tax relief to a lot of people who make less than $500,000 dollars. The amendment gives tax relief to a lot of folks who make less than that amount. [SPEAKER CHANGES] So, just so I'm clear I'm voting on a tax increase if I vote for the amendment? [SPEAKER CHANGES] You're also voting for some tax decreases. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you sir. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Any further discussion or debate? [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Rucho for what purpose do you rise? [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mr. President, to debate the amendment. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Clodfelter you have the floor. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you very much, you've done a lot of good work on what is a complicated area, but let's talk about a few of these issues. Let's talk about the WOTC credit where again, talking about going from 6% to 3% t make it revenue neutral. And something else that everyone here needs to know is that some of these issues will be impacted when tax reform comes forward at some point during a session, and so what we need to do is be sure that the numbers add up and also that we're also standing on the principals that we have in regard to tax reform. Let's talk about WOTC credit, urban bookings tax policy sent out a report on the WOTC program and basically came out and said there was no meaningful increase in the employment of disadvantaged as it contributed to the WOTC. And secondly, there also is a situation where we believe that a person should have the opportunity based on having the skills rather than just the opportunity of the fact that they could get a credit. So in essence the employer would try to choose someone who is prepared and qualified to do that. Secondly,talking about the mortgage insurance as an interest, mortgage insurance encourages people to purchase too much house and enters mortgages beyond their means, which is something that we're presently trying to work our way out of. That is why in 2009 we started all of this problem because of the fact programs like this ended up causing people to go beyond their limits as to what they could afford, and more importantly they didn't have enough to put...

Down payments on, we would rather encourage responsible lending and responsible borrowing and thirdly it's also the fact that it's not interest, it's actually paying the mortgage insurances and it does not actually help reduce the service so if we are moving in that direction, we should also provide exemption for home owner insurance. The other part about it is the exclusion for the discharge of the resident ??, again another program that the federal government put forward that allows for as a result turns out to be responsible real estate lending and again that's why we are in this recession that we can't seem to get out of. We actually see some light at the end of the tunnel and we don't believe that we would like to continue that trend down to a responsible lending and borrowing. And then the last piece of our earned income tax credit, just some facts about this program, It was started many years ago in the federal government but let's talk about a couple of issues, in 2009 the ?? was studied came out and evaluated this program (EIC) and between 25 and 33 percent there was a a fraudulent rate. In 2006 the ?? a 30.6 percent worse in proper payments and even as the IRS estimates between 23 and 28 percent fraud as of 2011. If you compare that program to other programs that are part of the ?? study it talks about other improper payments like medicare 3.6, Social security (SSI) 8.2, Food stamps 4.4 but EITC is 30.4 percent. The system is out of control. It does us no good to continue doing something similar to what we had with the medicare situation. You want to be sure that the money is used wisely and apparently on a federal level 23 to 28 percent and some would have about between 11 and 13 billion dollars an year of cost due to fraud. Ladies and gentleman of the senate, I appreciate Senator Carl Ford for bringing this forward but I'd say to you that this bill needs to pass and I say you defeat the amendment and move on to passing the bill. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Any further discussion or debate? Senator McKissick, for what purpose do you rise? [SPEAKER CHANGES] To speak on the amendment. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator, you have the floor. [SPEAKER CHANGES] With all due respect Senator Ruth's statements aside I guess I simply have to indicate that that I support the amendment. I think it's fair, I think it's reasonable, I think it's balanced, I think this is what we need to do as responsible legislatures. And if you think about the housing collapse the market that occurred in recent years since 2008 the onslaught of the recession that many individuals that really were not a part of it, they were lenders that went at there and established there fair markets, these people just paid what they were at that time. And unfortunately there are many people who are upside down in the mortgageships. Many people who are having a deal with short ?? of their properties. Many people that are adversely impacted due to the ?? that or the beyond anything they could control and If you find yourself as an individual in that particular set of circumstances ?? in fact way this amendment proposes up to 250 thousand dollars that was cancelled. And I say up to because it may be 50 thousand, it may be 25 thousand, it may be 100 thousand up to 250 you would be able to receive ?? of that cancellation and only on your principle residence. Not about investors, it's about people who live in those homes who have been adversely impacted. That's reasonable. Congress thought it should go further, congress said up to 2 millions. Senator Clark filtered his wisdom, I think it's a reasonable balance, 250 thousand. And like wise if you are one of those individuals that's not fortunate enough to have saved up 20 percent down payment, you don't have a gift from a family members provided to you and you are going with the 10 percent down payment and you are buying that home for the first time, even the second time, there are so many individuals are forced to do, are seeked to do, they are required if they don't have atleast 20 percent down to get the project mortgage insurance. Congress and it;s ?? has said, it was telling your principle residence. We are going to allow you to take that as a deduction the same way you would interest deduction on your principle residence. That's fair, that's reasonable, that's balanced. You look at the other components here ?? of income tax when it goes it qualifies for ?? at least among us..

And we oughta try to index it accordingly but try to make sure that we have something in place as this legislature has done so in the past. Work force development. We need to have jobs. We want people to be resourceful. We want employers to receive credits. It strikes a good a fair a reasonable balance. I would encourage you to support it. Certainly there’s no panacea. Certainly we could come up many other variations some of which might be better. Some might be worse. But I think what we have here compared to the alternatives on the table is far more fair far more reasonable far more balanced and helps the everyday person that we have been elected to represent. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mr. President. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Tillman for what purpose do you rise? [SPEAKER CHANGES] I’d like to ask Senator McKissick a question. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator McKissick do you yield for a question? [SPEAKER CHANGES] I do. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator made a comment that you did that Congress in its wisdom, I would like to ask you is this the same Congress in its wisdom that got us into 17 trillion dollars worth of debt? It is the same Congress we are talking about in’t it? [SPEAKER CHANGES] The Congress I’m speaking of was a bi-partisan group that supported this composed of Republicans and Democrats that thought this was fair and reasonable. I’m not going to sit there and embrace everything that this Congress does because there’s many things that this Congress does that I would respectfully have very serious disagreements with from time to time. But on this particular issue and we haven’t gone as far they would go. We’ve tried to strike a balance that’s far more reasonable far more commiserate with helping that individual that might be adversely impacted that has that $250,000 in debt on a principle residence not two million. So I think that Congress understood the concept that perhaps went a bit too far. But they have in fact tried to open the door in some areas in a way that we should be sensitive and responsive too. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Any further discussion or debate? [SPEAKER CHANGES] Mr. President. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator Stein for purpose do you rise? [SPEAKER CHANGES] To speak to the amendment. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Senator you have to the floor to speak to the amendment. [SPEAKER CHANGES] Thank you. Members of the Senate. There was a letter that was written by the National Association of Attorneys General in November to the U.S. Congress. 43 members. About half Democratic half Republican. And they wrote to urge Congress to pass legislation extending tax relief for citizens who have mortgage debt canceled or forgiven because of financial hardship where/g a decline in housing values. There is a mortgage crisis. Real estate prices have fallen precipitously in the last four or five years. So it is very common for people to owe substantially more on there home than it is worth today. So what lenders are determining is that it’s in the investors’ interest, the banks interest to go ahead and forgive some of that principle to make the mortgage more affordable so that the homeowner can continue to make their monthly payments. That way they stay in the home. Otherwise this bank has to foreclose on the home. They’re going to lose substantial amounts of principle because they can’t sell it at auction for anything more, near what the note is worth. The purpose is to make people’s lives better so that they can stay in their homes. That’s why Democrat and Republican Attorney Generals across the country urged Congress to enact it. In the fiscal cliff negotiations this provision was added in that bill. It was absolutely not a source of controversy. Republicans in Congress embraced it just as Democrats in Congress did. Because they knew we in America have a stake in keeping people in their homes. By decoupling this provision what you all are doing is for about 2,000 tax payers in this year Senator Tucker you’re going to raise taxes on them to the tune of about $5200 because on average they get about $75,000 in mortgage deduction either to their note. Or they’ve been foreclosed on and they a deficiency balance. And the bank says I’m not going to collect that from you. So I can just write this off, so you can have a clean credit record, and that way your life can be better and you can start moving on with your life. And maybe you can become a homeowner again. Well what we’re doing is we’re making these couple of thousand North Carolinians come up with $5,000 in cash for $75,000 in paper income. It’s not real dollars cash that they don’t have. Why else are they struggling? Again this is what the Attorneys General wrote Democrat Republican. This raises, it creates tax increases on the very families who can least afford it. So to your point Senator Tucker this bill that you all are passing unamended is a tax increase. But the ones you’re raising the taxes on are the families who are struggling the hardest. And that includes the people with earned income tax credit. 19%, one out of five

key: Mr. Can enhance the same for me and our other to: state incomes less than 14,000 dead is that end, timeouts and respects human race in taxes on the facts of the state's at the stop icon and feminist-times, and was the industry a enacted by as a mandate that that the best footage of the welfare and have them even possibly have ?? and those that have testified said all said that surfaced with hostility; when including time we have survived a chance, he's said is actually the schedule is one instance shifting the basement tests and stress and sometimes as many as a customer for the big deal, but the only five times and the citizens find that the 21 in the same advice is a fact those of the ad that everybody has found on the system to be an ongoing at the time I hope each of them in every member of this enables the latest attacks reform with weekly in the best way out for ?? copies of inviting people to work for the data for the two middle of it being out of-a-one concern that the drivers that run this opportunity, the past we all have them and see us play a lot of people have a chance to me how to sell the tops of the time the situation-season ended march pass on a scale he noted that session that the IMS forces-seven-for-offs as best we are ?? China and the same as I am of the arts and fast enough chance that the senate in a factor, as I have only have eight years so when the bomb and what the market is the Chinese and Indians and increasing someone's taxes pass the parts to bail it out and the signature of intense fighting for business year are taking whites only presentation you're taking my time I'm not sure that that that's what the deductions and 88, the time of reciting 841 in the December, when the time that you saying that happening out there who have with the depths of the great recessions lifetime-1990 deadline this has been adding that they'll take an updated in this party are some issues of this that from Thailand thing is taking why he that he from businessmen and that the data that west said they ?? so often that, in some areas that we now have become ?? if you can't have the better to say about sure what that means as for the fact that the Russians to find outside of the smelter ??, somewhere down the material is not just a Nationwide that the imprint of their time on a summary of support and-a- witness to a decline of us have a fulltime weeds out of this week the being discussed as product was in a raid on Friday, as and the report for tonight, we offer this amendment week vacation, and we think is solid that has said that all is about managing people's hands today enacted the family offered a more reasonable ways to solve them at the affable and everything, and within the website would bring the that have made offers only dominated update-the Euphrates and ½ debugging of tiled in that uniform human ??...........

him there are no question for the Senate is the passage of a memo. I doubt I was about no five seconds voting record about nineteen, having voted in the affirmative and thirty one in the negative amendment on sales and now the House Bill eighty two on amended, is backed by an further discussion or debate [SPEAKER CHANGES] turns on the question before the Senate is the passage of the committee substitute for House Bill eighty two on its second reading all about. I was about no five seconds providing court record about Walters, no gentlemen, I thirty two having an affirmative and eighteen in the negative committee substitute House Bill eighty two passes a second reading and will remain on calendar. many nurses analysis 's cousin 's favorite merchandise for announcement civilians there were big enough that you must present like to analysis Senate conferees for Senate Bill ten Chairman Senator Apodaca, members,senators would show the Roman margin and mandolin makers present a special set of purpose US announcement if organizing center. thanks, Congressman Jeff sessions to you send him out of order so you can send for you to be reborn out of order. thank you, Mister President, are going. Sarah Davis, the middle passage on the state of development committee,said Bill eleven unfavorable asked to committee substitute bill titles. an act to designate the month of April of each year. however, as organ donation awareness month and provide that the act shall be entitled Duffy, who all say Bill one eleven Sindelar eleven when using design build material unfair. last bill that they will ask a committee substitute bill that Davis miss the passage house bill thirty seven committee substitute number one, Cleveland County property transfer favorable [SPEAKER CHANGES] to eleven so the 1/11 hospital thirty seven calendar the other notices, announcements, as soon as the foreclosure on his own announcement if organisms and vitamins for the Democrats will callus immediately at/ him dressed in all or none at the forefront one personal privilege center colleagues is my pleasure to stand before you today in and give some announcement of something that occurred earlier today I hope each of you have had an opportunity to enjoy some of the many exhibits, and so forth. the conference related to the sportsmen 's Caucus saw that it is something going on in the rest of the talk about yesterday was we rather have a shooting contest. when the Senate and the House there are some unfortunate is that it will back him in the back also admitted he probably didn't you just shoot although you are so enormous. of course it does every town it was quite a CDH exhibition, but I'm really pleased to announce that Senator Daniel Senator Charles and Center search and I recall that I

Specific scores of 120, I fell by the wayside and got a 117. But in any event we smoked the house 477 to 469. So, we kept up the standards of our body, thank you very much. Mr. President. [SPEAKER CHANGES]Senator Apodaca, for what purpose do you [SPEAKER CHANGES]Moment of personal privilege please. [SPEAKER CHANGES]Senator you have the floor for appointed personal privilege. [SPEAKER CHANGES]Thank you Mr. President. For some people in this room, like senator Allran, they never seem to age. But some people in this room age very quickly, and it seems to me like senator Gunn has a birthday every other month, but he is claiming the one today, so wish senator Gunn happy birthday. [SPEAKER CHANGES]Are there any other notices or announcements? Is there any further business to come before the senate? If not the chair recognizes senator Berger for a motion. [SPEAKER CHANGES]Thank you Mr. President. I move now that the senate do now adjourn subject to the introduction of bills and resolutions, the receipt referral and re-referral of committee reports and the receipt of messages from the house and the governor to reconvene on Wednesday March 6th, 2013 at 2 pm. [SPEAKER CHANGES]The motion is that the senate do now adjourn subject to the stipulations stated by senator Berger to reconvene Wednesday March 6th at 2 pm, seconded by senator Harrington. All in favor say aye. Oppose no. The ayes have it. The senate stands adjourned.